Tomorrow, there's going to be a march against piracy joined by the entire recording industry. They also plan to have radio stations, movie theaters to stop showing/playing for some time. Why? So everyone can know what if feels like with no music.
Personally I 100% agree that we have a piracy problem BUT:
To punish everyone in Taiwan for what some people do is NOT RIGHT! The damn problem is with the government. They don't make it illegal to SELL PIRATED CDs or software!
In the US and Europe, there are no pirated CDs. Why? Because Americans and Europeans are better? No. Because there is NO SOURCE. When there is no source to buy it, then everyone buys it from the store (or mp3s--but that's another issue).
All we need is this:
Destroy the source.
A law that makes any selling of piracy a very serious felony punishable by a 10 year imprisonment and enforcable by all policemen. Note: I said a "very serious" felony. Note: I said "all policemen". I've tried to report sellers of pirated CDs to the police before in my neighborhood and what did the cops say?
"It's not our department. You must call the appropriate authority to deal with this".
WOW! If they have the power to arrest people for sale of drugs, for traffic violations.... then they should arrest sellers of ANY AND ALL illegal contraband.
Right now, the whole attention is to THE BUYERS. They are trying to make people feel bad that they are buying pirated CDs.
The attention needs to be on THE SELLERS. No sellers, then no one will buy and problem solved. Because buyers will always buy the cheapest choice available. We need to change our attention from the buyers to the sellers.
IFPI marches and artists in the news saying STOP Piracy! is no use at all.
Want to stop the piracy so we can all make a living in music? Fine, it's very simple.
PRESSURE THE GOVERNMENT TO ENFORCE ARRESTS OF ANY AND ALL SALE OF ILLEGAL ITEMS. which includes software such as music CDs.
Make the government make this #1 problem on its list to solve. This will improve the public world image of Taiwan (which is very bad now--just look in the news today!), and will also save our industry.
I'm so sick of this problem and everyone's doing it the wrong way. We'll never get rid of piracy in Taiwan like this.....
WHAT'S WRONG WITH THE ANTI-PIRACY FIGHTERS? CAN'T THEY SEE HOW TO SOLVE THIS PROBLEM THIS WAY???!!!!
So I'm going to march (all employees of Alfa) tomorrow and it's going to be alot of PR and it won't solve the problem even 10%. What a waste of time..........
IFPI反盜March tomorrow....
Moderators: 深白色 (Arys Chien), Michael Lin
-
MichaelHammer
- MidiMall 超級公民
- Posts: 221
- Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2002 7:42 pm
- Location: 台北市
IFPI反盜March tomorrow....
MICHAEL LIN
Compared with the pirated CD. The illegal copy of warez seems much more severe than this.
Do you know why government cannot fight for this?? Because they get money from this. Just like some record companies, they finally even print pirated CD by themselves. Make money and don't need to pay tax to the government(Another ways fo thinking)
The mainland China face the same problem too.
It's impossible to solve no matter how IFPI do. Sorrry I have to express the real thing although it's cruel. When someone need to buy this. Someone can get money from this. Someone will provide this. Music CD, that's not the important topic which makes governemnt to take a serious look . They don't care this because Pop music to them is just a recreation, amusement not an ART..... Unless the legal CD can affect the election. can makes more people to support a specific party. Then maybe they'll pay some attention on this.
So........We are tired of this several years ago. Still making music and do business as usual. Things won't change until foreign country punish our country like Super 301. They need a "punch"
Michael.....When you see your boss tomorrow. Please remind him -----"cxxxk", Need it so much, I only care this....haha!
Do you know why government cannot fight for this?? Because they get money from this. Just like some record companies, they finally even print pirated CD by themselves. Make money and don't need to pay tax to the government(Another ways fo thinking)
The mainland China face the same problem too.
It's impossible to solve no matter how IFPI do. Sorrry I have to express the real thing although it's cruel. When someone need to buy this. Someone can get money from this. Someone will provide this. Music CD, that's not the important topic which makes governemnt to take a serious look . They don't care this because Pop music to them is just a recreation, amusement not an ART..... Unless the legal CD can affect the election. can makes more people to support a specific party. Then maybe they'll pay some attention on this.
So........We are tired of this several years ago. Still making music and do business as usual. Things won't change until foreign country punish our country like Super 301. They need a "punch"
Michael.....When you see your boss tomorrow. Please remind him -----"cxxxk", Need it so much, I only care this....haha!
Paul Fang
--真心對待每個人，認真做好每件事--
--真心對待每個人，認真做好每件事--
-
MichaelHammer
- MidiMall 超級公民
- Posts: 221
- Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2002 7:42 pm
- Location: 台北市
who cares....
Paul,
Yes the problem with pirated Warez (software) is very severe but if you've noticed these days, a lot of companies only use legal software because they don't want to get caught. If their offices have illegal software, the fines are pretty steep! At least there is some improvement there but I don't write software so I don't really care!!!
It's true, if you can make money from it and there is a demand..then there's the supply. BUT the government should make it more difficult for them to do it... Or is the police only concerned about traffic tickets?! I'll answer my own question: yes. Government is a "company" and their main concern in making money.... any government is this way but the piracy makes them lose money too...less sales tax, less corporate tax on record companies,.... In the end, it hurts everyone but the gangsters that make money from it.
I think that one day, another Super 301 or something will make some changes in the "software pirate biz" but it's sad to see that Taiwan only moves when pressured by overseas. It's embarrassing. We should be doing it on our own....
Ah who cares?! The only reason I care is cuz it affects my income. I'm not a moral standards policeman but damned if I let some stupid gangster make money from my work. Man, this pisses me off!
BTW, Paul, I sent an ICQ message to you. Did you get it? It will be signed tomorrow so it's all set.
Yes the problem with pirated Warez (software) is very severe but if you've noticed these days, a lot of companies only use legal software because they don't want to get caught. If their offices have illegal software, the fines are pretty steep! At least there is some improvement there but I don't write software so I don't really care!!!
It's true, if you can make money from it and there is a demand..then there's the supply. BUT the government should make it more difficult for them to do it... Or is the police only concerned about traffic tickets?! I'll answer my own question: yes. Government is a "company" and their main concern in making money.... any government is this way but the piracy makes them lose money too...less sales tax, less corporate tax on record companies,.... In the end, it hurts everyone but the gangsters that make money from it.
I think that one day, another Super 301 or something will make some changes in the "software pirate biz" but it's sad to see that Taiwan only moves when pressured by overseas. It's embarrassing. We should be doing it on our own....
Ah who cares?! The only reason I care is cuz it affects my income. I'm not a moral standards policeman but damned if I let some stupid gangster make money from my work. Man, this pisses me off!
BTW, Paul, I sent an ICQ message to you. Did you get it? It will be signed tomorrow so it's all set.
MICHAEL LIN
I totally agree with you...
But when you lose your income. Maybe your boss get money from pirate CDs. I don't want to say that. Once they find they cannot stop pirated CD, they printed by themselves. They get less money from pirated CDs but they don't ahve to pay 版稅 and income/consumer tax....That's weird but some said it's true.....
Actually Pirated CD in Taiwan just like Drugs(MDMA, LSD...). The only way is strictly execute the law. For Ex. If someone buy pirated CDs, he'll be in jail for 5 years......
But what do most people here think?? If people support pirated CD indeed in their heart just want to spend less money but don't care the Q'ty.....Then, I think government here won't pay attention on this. Cause maybe policeman himself listen to MP3 too....
So sad..But it's real world...
Just like people here ask me about legal sampler CD, legal plug-ins, legal warez. I have no answer....
But when you lose your income. Maybe your boss get money from pirate CDs. I don't want to say that. Once they find they cannot stop pirated CD, they printed by themselves. They get less money from pirated CDs but they don't ahve to pay 版稅 and income/consumer tax....That's weird but some said it's true.....
Actually Pirated CD in Taiwan just like Drugs(MDMA, LSD...). The only way is strictly execute the law. For Ex. If someone buy pirated CDs, he'll be in jail for 5 years......
But what do most people here think?? If people support pirated CD indeed in their heart just want to spend less money but don't care the Q'ty.....Then, I think government here won't pay attention on this. Cause maybe policeman himself listen to MP3 too....
So sad..But it's real world...
Just like people here ask me about legal sampler CD, legal plug-ins, legal warez. I have no answer....
Paul Fang
--真心對待每個人，認真做好每件事--
--真心對待每個人，認真做好每件事--
-
Dragon_Huang
- MidiMall 金牌家族天王
- Posts: 8183
- Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2002 11:52 pm
- Location: Muzik Workshop
- Contact:
It's a real world !!!
Let's wait and see what will happend after today's Anti-pirated big march !
I will say,
It's all the same, dude.......
and about Paul's theory ... HAHA...I heard that at same day with Paul ..
It's hard to believe, but I think it might be real.....
Sad, right ?
The record's logo is real sucks " stop buy the pirate CD "
Why don't they " Crack down all the pirate CD factory " ?
Cuz they afraid the gangster might burn thier home in night ..
Let's wait and see what will happend after today's Anti-pirated big march !
I will say,
It's all the same, dude.......
and about Paul's theory ... HAHA...I heard that at same day with Paul ..
It's hard to believe, but I think it might be real.....
Sad, right ?
The record's logo is real sucks " stop buy the pirate CD "
Why don't they " Crack down all the pirate CD factory " ?
Cuz they afraid the gangster might burn thier home in night ..
-
Guest
如果這個島上的人, 85%只關心兩件事情.
1;璩美鳳的偷拍事件.
2;樂透彩卷.
如果這個島上的政治人物,幾乎 100%只會一直吵國安局
的洩密事件.幾乎 100%在吵 嘿嘿嘿的電話是誰打的.
Who will pay any attention to the pirate CDs???
This is the most sad thing.
我們的著作權法其實是很嚴格的,很諷刺吧 ?
這樣可怕的盜版行為,.配上這樣高標準的著作權法.
如果我是一個政治人物,我會不會想;高鐵有多少錢可以ㄠ?
我關心一下八吋晶圓有多少錢可以ㄠ?
哪一個政治人物會秀逗到關心 pirate CDs??
Hey! WAKE UP !! People!!!
這是一個警官包娼包賭,警員白吃白嫖的社會.
這是一個大官A大錢,小官A小錢的國家.
I hate to tell the truth, BUT, What I'm gonna say is dam true!
黑社會盜版不可怕, MP3 Down Load不可怕.
出版商自己盜自己的版才是真正的可怕.
各位音樂工作者,黑社會偷你的錢,你知道那叫做盜版.
那你知不知道出版商偷你的錢,那叫做什麼??????
各位,社會很亂,盜版很猖狂,這是事實.
如果你相信政府會大力整頓盜版(包括黑的盜版和白的盜版)會變成事實....
Let me ask you a questuion, HOW OLD ARE YOU?????????
I have one last announce to state;
"敬告所有黑的盜版商與白的盜版商,本篇言論完全不代表 MIDIMALL
以及除了Alex FOHO以外所有討論區的會員之立場"
馬的!誰告訴我哪裡可以買到衝鋒槍和C4塑膠炸藥???
1;璩美鳳的偷拍事件.
2;樂透彩卷.
如果這個島上的政治人物,幾乎 100%只會一直吵國安局
的洩密事件.幾乎 100%在吵 嘿嘿嘿的電話是誰打的.
Who will pay any attention to the pirate CDs???
This is the most sad thing.
我們的著作權法其實是很嚴格的,很諷刺吧 ?
這樣可怕的盜版行為,.配上這樣高標準的著作權法.
如果我是一個政治人物,我會不會想;高鐵有多少錢可以ㄠ?
我關心一下八吋晶圓有多少錢可以ㄠ?
哪一個政治人物會秀逗到關心 pirate CDs??
Hey! WAKE UP !! People!!!
這是一個警官包娼包賭,警員白吃白嫖的社會.
這是一個大官A大錢,小官A小錢的國家.
I hate to tell the truth, BUT, What I'm gonna say is dam true!
黑社會盜版不可怕, MP3 Down Load不可怕.
出版商自己盜自己的版才是真正的可怕.
各位音樂工作者,黑社會偷你的錢,你知道那叫做盜版.
那你知不知道出版商偷你的錢,那叫做什麼??????
各位,社會很亂,盜版很猖狂,這是事實.
如果你相信政府會大力整頓盜版(包括黑的盜版和白的盜版)會變成事實....
Let me ask you a questuion, HOW OLD ARE YOU?????????
I have one last announce to state;
"敬告所有黑的盜版商與白的盜版商,本篇言論完全不代表 MIDIMALL
以及除了Alex FOHO以外所有討論區的會員之立場"
馬的!誰告訴我哪裡可以買到衝鋒槍和C4塑膠炸藥???
-
Dragon_Huang
- MidiMall 金牌家族天王
- Posts: 8183
- Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2002 11:52 pm
- Location: Muzik Workshop
- Contact:
都去喝花酒了...
嗯~404的遊行~
我抱著一顆對音樂熱愛的心去了~
雖然自己不代表什麼?~但起碼用行動告知了我對盜版的抗議!
基於對本版的尊重與清靜~
就不轉訴一些很幹又機車的盜版商對這次404挑釁的行為了!
總之~
就算我們都可以不用在音樂賺到該得的酬勞~
卻也不願別人拿我們的創作與對音樂的努力去薛錢!
這就是我的想法!!!
了解:
1.盜版對流行音樂的傷害
2.正版/盜版辨識
3.各國售價比較
網址:
http://www.ifpi.org.tw/activity/act_index.htm
我抱著一顆對音樂熱愛的心去了~
雖然自己不代表什麼?~但起碼用行動告知了我對盜版的抗議!
基於對本版的尊重與清靜~
就不轉訴一些很幹又機車的盜版商對這次404挑釁的行為了!
總之~
就算我們都可以不用在音樂賺到該得的酬勞~
卻也不願別人拿我們的創作與對音樂的努力去薛錢!
這就是我的想法!!!
了解:
1.盜版對流行音樂的傷害
2.正版/盜版辨識
3.各國售價比較
網址:
http://www.ifpi.org.tw/activity/act_index.htm
音樂死囚~隨時待機逃獄!!!
-
Jonathan
- 基本公民...大步邁進中
- Posts: 33
- Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2002 12:33 am
- Location: Taipei, Shanghai, LA, NY
I saw the Anti-Piracy March from TV yesterday and I must say something about it.
First, one simple question, how many of you would really think that the overall music industry and market will be better off if the government takes some decisive and effective actions against piracy? I'm afraid the answer is not as positive as some people would expect.
For many years, "some" top management of the Major 5 have been working so hard trying every possible way to "rip off" their company. That is, 從宣傳費,製作費以及生產加工成本之中去A錢...and they can easily make NT$20 million a year into their own pocket. At that time, they seldom pirated their own CDs because they needed to boost the sales figure of legal copies to show the BIG BOSS in headquarter that the music market in taiwan is so huge and promising and ask for more investment from them, which provide them more opportunities to A錢...BUT, when the market is going down and they face an overall cost-cut, they start to pirate their own CDs as it becomes the most efficient way for them to make their tax-free money. AND...the most shocking fact is, even some people from IFPI might be involved with this piracy scheme...SO, it's an old saying that "家賊難防"....SO, there're many dirty deals and Music Politics which makes yesterday's march nothing but a FARCE!
In fact, what really matter are MP3 download and CD burning for private use...Because no law enforcement in the world would ever dare to penalize such actions. Just recall 6 or 7 years ago, when the price for CD-RW are still high and there was no MP3, the music market were nevertheless considered steadily growing despite of the ever-increasing piracy. BUT how about now? and in the near future??? The CD-RW become so affordable nowadays and no one can exactly calculate how many copies have have been made from it for so-called "personal use". The situation will be intensified when CD-RW become the integral and standard part (just like CD-ROM drive) for every desktop PC and Laptop, that day will come SOON.....and VERY SOON!!!
So, will the music industry slowly die away?....Of course NOT, but it has certainly passed its PRIME. The music workers must be proactive to face the ever-changing environment and technology enhancement. Taiwan's music market has been a "over-saturated" market for many years. The unsound infrastructure created by recording companies, media, A&R people and artist management which make Taiwan's music industry more vulnerable. It's like a "vicious circle" in a way that the entire music industry is now facing the consequence. It's INEVITABLE and no one can change it. As a result, it's a good thing from certain point of view that the music industry can refine itself through evolution.
I personally don't agree at all at some artists' statements such as "如果消費者再買盜版, 我們就活不下去了..." Seeing those glamorous stars with stylish life and high income, the consumers WILL NOT GIVE A DAMN if you're selling beef noodle or being a gas station worker in the future. What they are concerned is how to pay less for a CD and they don't care if you make less bucks....besides, most artists are more wealthy than average consumers....The majority of consumers will rely on their own judgement of "fairness" when it comes to buying behavior. It's simply "human nature" and nobody can defy it at all.
Sometimes I feel fortunate that I made the right decision to retire from the music industry in early 2000. I never intend to lament Taiwan's music industry even though I might sound pessimistic. But the truth is, it's a whole NEW BALL GAME now and new rules are yet to be set up. It requires new mentality and vision to exploit new opportunities in the diversified music business. I might re-join this ball game soon in Shanghai, well, who knows???
Last but not least, I can say that:
--The law enforement might start to bust and crash down the piracy, but this action will not be constant, the government is also 做秀而已...and it's unlikely that they'll be able to bust those who pulling the strings in the vast piracy network in Taiwan.
--Even the Legislature DO makes the act of copyright infringement a "public offense" crime, our legal system and the Courts are unlikely to make rulings as effective deterance against piracy.
--There will be more MP3 download and more copies are made from personal CD burner.
As the situation is deteriorating and Taiwan's music market is no longer lucrative, everything will go back to its very basic and starting point. In economics, it's called "Market Equilibrium"...whereas reasonable amount of market players as Input (fewer record companies, fewer artists, less marketing cost...etc.) to re-adjust the market sturcture and to achieve reasonable Output which would meet the "genuine" demand. For example, among those artists or singers who participated in the march yesterday, I must say at least half of them are NEVER supposed to be releasing any album at all! They are simply unqualified to become recording artists. Period!!! If the record company 投機取巧, 逆勢操作...you could only blame yourself if the record is a total flop!
OK, I must stop here now, otherwise I'll feel that I'm writing a thesis. However, I welcome any comment or feedback or even...private phone call....
First, one simple question, how many of you would really think that the overall music industry and market will be better off if the government takes some decisive and effective actions against piracy? I'm afraid the answer is not as positive as some people would expect.
For many years, "some" top management of the Major 5 have been working so hard trying every possible way to "rip off" their company. That is, 從宣傳費,製作費以及生產加工成本之中去A錢...and they can easily make NT$20 million a year into their own pocket. At that time, they seldom pirated their own CDs because they needed to boost the sales figure of legal copies to show the BIG BOSS in headquarter that the music market in taiwan is so huge and promising and ask for more investment from them, which provide them more opportunities to A錢...BUT, when the market is going down and they face an overall cost-cut, they start to pirate their own CDs as it becomes the most efficient way for them to make their tax-free money. AND...the most shocking fact is, even some people from IFPI might be involved with this piracy scheme...SO, it's an old saying that "家賊難防"....SO, there're many dirty deals and Music Politics which makes yesterday's march nothing but a FARCE!
In fact, what really matter are MP3 download and CD burning for private use...Because no law enforcement in the world would ever dare to penalize such actions. Just recall 6 or 7 years ago, when the price for CD-RW are still high and there was no MP3, the music market were nevertheless considered steadily growing despite of the ever-increasing piracy. BUT how about now? and in the near future??? The CD-RW become so affordable nowadays and no one can exactly calculate how many copies have have been made from it for so-called "personal use". The situation will be intensified when CD-RW become the integral and standard part (just like CD-ROM drive) for every desktop PC and Laptop, that day will come SOON.....and VERY SOON!!!
So, will the music industry slowly die away?....Of course NOT, but it has certainly passed its PRIME. The music workers must be proactive to face the ever-changing environment and technology enhancement. Taiwan's music market has been a "over-saturated" market for many years. The unsound infrastructure created by recording companies, media, A&R people and artist management which make Taiwan's music industry more vulnerable. It's like a "vicious circle" in a way that the entire music industry is now facing the consequence. It's INEVITABLE and no one can change it. As a result, it's a good thing from certain point of view that the music industry can refine itself through evolution.
I personally don't agree at all at some artists' statements such as "如果消費者再買盜版, 我們就活不下去了..." Seeing those glamorous stars with stylish life and high income, the consumers WILL NOT GIVE A DAMN if you're selling beef noodle or being a gas station worker in the future. What they are concerned is how to pay less for a CD and they don't care if you make less bucks....besides, most artists are more wealthy than average consumers....The majority of consumers will rely on their own judgement of "fairness" when it comes to buying behavior. It's simply "human nature" and nobody can defy it at all.
Sometimes I feel fortunate that I made the right decision to retire from the music industry in early 2000. I never intend to lament Taiwan's music industry even though I might sound pessimistic. But the truth is, it's a whole NEW BALL GAME now and new rules are yet to be set up. It requires new mentality and vision to exploit new opportunities in the diversified music business. I might re-join this ball game soon in Shanghai, well, who knows???
Last but not least, I can say that:
--The law enforement might start to bust and crash down the piracy, but this action will not be constant, the government is also 做秀而已...and it's unlikely that they'll be able to bust those who pulling the strings in the vast piracy network in Taiwan.
--Even the Legislature DO makes the act of copyright infringement a "public offense" crime, our legal system and the Courts are unlikely to make rulings as effective deterance against piracy.
--There will be more MP3 download and more copies are made from personal CD burner.
As the situation is deteriorating and Taiwan's music market is no longer lucrative, everything will go back to its very basic and starting point. In economics, it's called "Market Equilibrium"...whereas reasonable amount of market players as Input (fewer record companies, fewer artists, less marketing cost...etc.) to re-adjust the market sturcture and to achieve reasonable Output which would meet the "genuine" demand. For example, among those artists or singers who participated in the march yesterday, I must say at least half of them are NEVER supposed to be releasing any album at all! They are simply unqualified to become recording artists. Period!!! If the record company 投機取巧, 逆勢操作...you could only blame yourself if the record is a total flop!
OK, I must stop here now, otherwise I'll feel that I'm writing a thesis. However, I welcome any comment or feedback or even...private phone call....
To be a Rock and not to Roll..!!!
-
Digital_Vox
- MidiMall 進階公民
- Posts: 140
- Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2002 1:58 am
- Location: Taipei, Vancouver